Procar 4wd class as requested

[jimmynova]

PSM Motorsport Ltd have today announced that they have revised the class structure of the 2010 Fuchs Lubricants Rallycross Open Championship to include a new Procar four wheel drive category.
Division 1 and Division 1S will be merged together under the banner of 'Supercar', with the new Procar Four Wheel Drive category adding a further dimension to the Rallycross Open Championship. The category has been designed to provide competitors with the opportunity to race four wheel drive, turbo charged cars at an affordable price. We anticipate that these cars could cost as little as £3500 ready to race with 300+ BHP. The cars will run in one class for cars with turbo charged engine capacities up to 2000cc.
2009 Fuchs Lubricants Rallycross Open Super National Champion, Jamie Lea has already started to build a Procar four wheel drive car for 2010. "This is a fantastic new category in the Rallycross Open Championship and my Toyota MR2 is now for sale. Contrary to certain newspaper publications, I am 100% committed to racing exclusively in the Rallycross Open Championship in 2010. We are going to produce a car that is going to turn a lot of heads and it will be very competitive against the Supercars." added Lea.
The main features of the new Procar four wheel drive category regulations include:
- The engine and gearbox must be as originally fitted as original equipment to the car and be in the original location.
- The standard electronic control unit and the ignition components in the electronic control unit must be retained.
- The standard exhaust manifold must be retained.
- Turbos must remain standard, but there is no restrictor plate required.
- The standard gearbox casing and all internals MUST be retained. Gear ratios & final drive ratios must be the same as originally supplied for that model of car.
- The engine and ecu will be sealed at the first event that the vehicle competes in.
- There is no restriction on the make or type of tyres used.
"We have been looking at this concept in different forms for the last six months. After Gareth Wood finished third overall in the 2009 Rallycross Superprix with a similar specification car, it underlined that there is a great demand from competitors for an affordable four wheel drive turbo charged category. There is already three cars under construction and this is going to be a big success." added PSM Motorsport Ltd Director Peter Stott.
For further information on the new category and to obtain provisional regulations (Subject to MSA approval) please contact PSM Motorsport Ltd.

For further information on the 2010 Fuchs Lubricants Rallycross Open Championship, 2010 Fuchs Lubricants Rallycross Superprix and 2009/10 Fuchs Lubricants Northern Ireland Rallycross Open Championship please contact PSM Motorsport Ltd on Tel: +44(0) 7791 900770 or by emailing Peter@RallycrossOpen.com

[MESHGA]

Well bloody hooray
seams this forum can get things done
As ive said before I know of quite a few who will do this

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by MESHGA

seams this forum can get things done

Feel the power

Could be an interesting class - I'm assuming that any cars that are legal for this could quite happily run in the British Championship too? (albeit in supercar against the really snorty stuff). Is BTRDA supercar still around next year? They'd fit well there too.

[MESHGA]

Originally Posted by BertMk2

Feel the power

Could be an interesting class - I'm assuming that any cars that are legal for this could quite happily run in the British Championship too? (albeit in supercar against the really snorty stuff). Is BTRDA supercar still around next year? They'd fit well there too.

Yes Bert feel the people power !!! fair play tho ! as when did Orgs take notice of drivers ideas?
Anyway like the idea of BTRDA too, as it gives drivers choice which is a good thing!! and why not take advantage of someone elses idea!!
Even better in the british as an alternative class instead of a 2 wheel drive shopping car !
Any thoughts on that 1?

[keentowatch]

Peter Stott and his team obviously do listen to what the competitor wants, its a shame he or his championship does not get the recognition they deserve....

[MESHGA]

Originally Posted by keentowatch

Peter Stott and his team obviously do listen to what the competitor wants, its a shame he or his championship does not get the recognition they deserve....

Yes i agree there but both championships have their appeal

[leonidas]

Well done to Peter and his team for listening and taking a positive lead. Time to head for the garage...

[flying flynn]

Well done Peter

I believe this is the exact same idea that I suggested for the Open Championship last year,
In fact reading it its EXACTLY the same regs.MY REGS[ as invented by Pat]

The MDA will also be running this class, in their championship, for Clubmen, with a REAL prize.

Thanks Peter, you said this wouldnt work in the OPEN Championship.

Pat

[Kevin McCann]

Originally Posted by flying flynn

Well done Peter

I believe this is the exact same idea that I suggested for the Open Championship last year,
In fact reading it its EXACTLY the same regs.MY REGS[ as invented by Pat]

The MDA will also be running this class, in their championship, for Clubmen, with a REAL prize.

Thanks Peter, you said this wouldnt work in the OPEN Championship.

Pat

Well done Pat!!! Perhaps you can enlighten us on how you would police such a class? I think its a long overdue format but am concerned as to who has the knowledge to ensure fair play?

[MESHGA]

Originally Posted by Kevin McCann

Well done Pat!!! Perhaps you can enlighten us on how you would police such a class? I think its a long overdue format but am concerned as to who has the knowledge to ensure fair play?

Kevin im hoping to find out such stuff too ,Im sure it has been thought about and like Pat have said about doing this before ! but does it matter its a class now so lets get racing

[rallycrosscraig]

Ok so what cars are we likely to see used in this?

Impreza
early Evo
Mazda 323 turbo
sierra cossie 4x4
lancia delta
legacy turbo

? What else

[keentowatch]

Well thank god Peter has announecd this 1st as im a 100% sure he will give it the support and backing it deserves, not twisted and tweaked at his own discretion...

[flying flynn]

I am only going for Evo 1-4, and Subaru to 98

Based on the Jap imports, with one suspension type [simple no remote res],
Turbo no restrictor, no Gems Anti Lag etc, keep rest standard engine and box wise.
All attend a Rolling road session week before 1st meet, have a shootout and a social, get engines, box, diff sealed.
Then Race.

If seals need to be broken for maintenance/Breakage, then scrutineer seal at next meet, and car to go to RR before following meet.

Pat

[RICKY_BOBBY]

not sure about this rolling road idea, that can surely only have a point in a one make/model series what does everyone having to go to a rolling road solve other than unessecary expense and time.
eg 1995 impreza wrx 211bhp standard
1995 impreza wrx ra 280 bhp standard
1996 evo 4 270bhp
1995 gtir sunny 212 bhp
1995 sierra cos 220bhp
no cars are the same so what does a rolling road solve
i hope the organisers dont spoil this class before it starts just let the competitor build their cars to a set of rules that are simple and dont involve daft rules that in the grand scheme of things make no real difference to cost. my car wont be going in this class because it had a £160 aftermarket part fitted to it before the superprix because the part was twice the price to replace with genuine subaru

[Mad Mark Watson]

as you may know i ran in group n with escort cosworth few years back and we bent the rules something terrible got to be the man with the most money who could disguise the truth won!!!

i.e. belgian gearbox kits, anti lag, special chips etc. even down to lightening panels etc.

policing will be difficult ii think

[bigdick1977]

Mark, you can't have bent them as much as some! I worked on an Escort Cossie, group N, that was probably more group A than N.

[Chessmsport]

Originally Posted by Mad Mark Watson

as you may know i ran in group n with escort cosworth few years back and we bent the rules something terrible got to be the man with the most money who could disguise the truth won!!!

i.e. belgian gearbox kits, anti lag, special chips etc. even down to lightening panels etc.

policing will be difficult ii think

Thats the problem with production/group n/stock type classes, always has been, thats why I have disagreed in other threads that this class will be cheap.

Having said that its starting to grow on me, a Subaru now seems more appealing than a modified Metro!!

Is the rolling road actually one of the rules ? Cant see the point in sealing of engines gearboxes ECU's etc, surely if people are cheating your just sealing in the cheats!

[Hickey]

I like the idea of this but there is a nagging issue with it... it's just another factor further forcing apart the two series. One has gone for Swift (different story, different day!!!) and one for 4wd production. If they had opted for the same thing, we could well have seen more "competitors in common" and bigger grids for both series. With the Swifts, lack of minicross in BRDA, change in rules to juniors in ROC, BMWs, Procar/stockhatch/16v/2000cc, revivals, and now this, the divergence between the two series could well become insurmountable.

I realise that not everyone cares/wants one series (or at least a crossing over of competitors and venues) but I do as I think it is the only way to further the sport and these off-seasons times should be spent building bridges, not adding new rivers.

[RICKY_BOBBY]

i agree that policing it will be tricky but i dont think the class will be like the old group n class where cars were still around the 20k mark to buy as road cars. donor cars for this class can be found for literally hundreds not thousands. engine seals and mandatory rolling roads will stop people from rallying and autox coming out in their cars for a play. i believe this class will attract more intrest than the swifts. i built my car for one third of the cost of a swift and came third at the superprix in d1. what would most people rather drive? a turbo 4x4 or for three times more money a slow front wheel drive car. (iam in no way connected to either organisation and will compete in both next year in supercar) iam really looking forward to next year now and this new class helps, pherhaps classes that are only getting two or three entries should all be put together eg bmws go in revivals and just have it as one big class

[Citroen Manic]

The Open Procar 4WD class is for any sub 2LTR turbo 4WD car (as per the press release) NOT AS Pat's MDA 4WD class (only for EVO1-4 and Subaru-98).

There will be no rolling road session for Open Procar 4WD cars prior to the season.

The regs have been written by the PSM Team and will be published VERY SOON!!

This looks to be a VERY popular new class invented by ten-tenths members and initiated by Peter and his team at PSM Motorsport in response to competitor demand.

[rallycrosscraig]

you could also have a calibra or cavalier 4x4 turbo for this class

[MESHGA]

Well i like the format and recon "as said by me and others" will make big waves in the future of "British Rallycross" long live afordable racing
Re point sealing stuff!!!! If you are a creat you look a prat when you get excluded and fined by MSA so whats the point ???
As for what other orgs are doing !! if you want to race a curtain car go on !!! point taken about rivers but the "life boat" for minicross and stockhatch in the BRDA got a leak yonks ago!

[Thundersports]

Great decision to run the series I think the BRDA missed a real opportunity.

[Mad Mark Watson]

knew both other escort cossies and you are right defo nearly or same as group A

don't argue good class my only worry now as Rallycross in the UK pulls apart from each other and creates more classes instead of pooling resources and making a few very full classes and moves forward

We look to Europe 3 major classes more simpler for speccys and competitors alike not saying we run along those lines due to Budget and complexity

Guess i still hanker back to the days i started where The 3 formulas commanded 60 or so cars per class at meetings and people in the street under stood the difference immediately and enjoyed full grids and close racing with smaller cars still over turning the big boys

[mr escort]

So Whos building one then ????