205 1.6 GTi Racing History

[SFurness]

Hello,

I bought a 205 1.6 GTi which is thought to have been originally built by Janspeed (one of two) for a Production Saloon Car Series, Lumenition Slick 50 Saloon Car Championship ??

It has a seam welded shell and Peugeot Sport front hubs giving a fixed negative camber of about 4 degrees.

Various other modifications over the years but has a Lumenition competition engine management system which may be original.

Anybody with any ideas ??

Currently racing it with the CSCC Tin Tops

Steve

[Tim Wilkinson]

I think Janspeed ran 205s in one of the prodsaloon championships the mid-late 80s, one for Kieth Odor (son of Janspeed owner Jan) before they moved onto Nissans.

The Slick 50 was a roadsaloon championship - Slick 50 were the sponsor from 89 (or earlier) up to the mid-90s, when it was sponsored by Lumenition and Blue Coral (or the other way around). The regs originally specified road legal cars, driven to and from the circuit, and outlawed adjustable suspension top mounts - the roadsaloon Astra I owned a few years ago had adjustment, after a fashion, in the lower wishbones.

I've got a lot of Slick 50 results sheets from '95 to '02, and a few from earlier than that, so if you can provide a name of previous owner, or even a race number for a year (old scrutineering tickets?), I can find out some info.

Do you have any pictures of the car?

[joss Ronchetti]

I raced a 205gti 1.9 in 1988 Uniroyal/Monroe Production saloons against Keith Odour in his similar car..with one of his side exit flame throwing exhausts fitted on mine. That a 1.9 though not a 1.6.

[SFurness]

Hi,

I bought it from a chap in the NE near Whitby, he had it a couple of years and upgraded the engine and transmision and brakes which were previously drums on the rear.

The rear light clusters suggest pre 1990 and the gearbox was changed for the BE3 unit which is post 1989.

How do I add photographs ??

[stockhatcher]

hello, newbie here only joined because i think i can help with this thread. Didi you buy the car from Phil Latham who was Scarborough based, he originally bought it in 2001 to race in roadsaloons, thne went off to do northern sports and saloons. I believe the car was fettled in this period by racing solutions of Southampton - Neil Brogden was the owners name. Not sure about the Janspeed link I was under the impression that it was built by racing solutions, however could be wrong. It never did much in the previous drivers hands in either road saloons or NSCC.

IIRC it should be running lumenition with throttle bodies, is red and white on the inside, possibly with a momo safari twin spoke steering wheel.

but there again i could be wrong.

[SFurness]

You could be right.


Its red with white on the inside, Lumenition on throttle bodies, Momo steering wheel.

I'll check with the previous owner on who he bought it from.

Steve

[SFurness]

Yes it was owned by Phil Latham and Neil Brogden had been involved with the car.

The chap I bought it from had it for a couple of years and his son raced it.


Did you know Phil Latham ?


Steve

[stockhatcher]

Originally Posted by SFurness

Yes it was owned by Phil Latham and Neil Brogden had been involved with the car.

The chap I bought it from had it for a couple of years and his son raced it.


Did you know Phil Latham ?


Steve

yup i knew Phil quite well, lost touch when he went to Northern sports and i went to stock hatch, he spent quite a bit on it but he wasn't much of a driver though - nice guy tho. not sure what other info i can give you other than it was never bashed in Phil's hands so it was probably pretty straight up until he sold it.

ask me some questions about it and i might have some answers.


memories are coming back to me now..

the engine if it still the original build by racing solutions is a bit pony, even with throbble botties its only getting 135ish.
fairly certain its not a janspeed car. Was originally a 1985 c plater i think, be3 box is a standard trick i think the 3rd 4th and 5th ratios are lower. it might have a slippy diff in it, otherwise it will have a 4:3 final drive, or is it a 4:4, anyway the one that gives better acceleration over top speed.

the mods of throttle bodies, hubs, i think were carried out at the end of 2001 beginning 2002 by a guy in Oxfordshire who used to do work on my old 205. Neil Brogden can be contacted through Linkln, I have the guy in Oxford's phone number if you really want to know what was done to it. However it was 8 years ago and I suspect he has forgotten about it.

hth

[kelvin88]

Originally Posted by Tim Wilkinson

I think Janspeed ran 205s in one of the prodsaloon championships the mid-late 80s, one for Kieth Odor (son of Janspeed owner Jan) before they moved onto Nissans.

Kieth was using a Cosworth in the Uniroyal Production Saloons in the '80s

[SFurness]

Hello Stockhatcher,

Mike, who I bought it from, tweaked the engine with :

"1600cc on 45mm Throttle Bodies, Big Valve fully flowed head with 3 angle valve seats, Kent PT28 Race Cam with Vernier Cam Pulley, Forged Pistons with ARP big end bolts, New Alloy Flywheel and Helix 4 Paddle Ceramic Clutch. All Lightened and Balanced. The engine produces 173 BHP and 127 lb ft of Torque with Dyno sheets to verify"

Plus:

"Close Ratio PTS BE3 with latest 4.8 Tran-X Plated LSD."

Its quick and puts the power down.

Last time out it had a chronic misfire at 6000 rpm (it revs to 7300). Since its last outing it had the water pump changed which ment the cam belt being taken off and refitted, I hit the wall at Silverstone on the side where the coil is fitted. And the petrol changed colour !!

I'd used Total Exellium which was always amber but on this occasion it was colourless. It could be the petrol. I'm draining it down and with Shell 99 in it am going on a rolling road (plus a spare coil) to get it sorted.

One annoying problem is the sump leaks oil (drips a little) apparently its a comon fault with the steel sumps. ??


Steve

[Tim Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by kelvin88

Kieth was using a Cosworth in the Uniroyal Production Saloons in the '80s

He ran a 205 the first year he did Proddies. As Joss said, though, it was a 1.9. He had done rallies before that, as a way to promote the business, found he was quicker on tarmac than dirt (could have been Astra challenge) and switched to circuits accordingly then began to pick up external support and went to the Cossie.

[stockhatcher]

Originally Posted by SFurness

Hello Stockhatcher,

Mike, who I bought it from, tweaked the engine with :

"1600cc on 45mm Throttle Bodies, Big Valve fully flowed head with 3 angle valve seats, Kent PT28 Race Cam with Vernier Cam Pulley, Forged Pistons with ARP big end bolts, New Alloy Flywheel and Helix 4 Paddle Ceramic Clutch. All Lightened and Balanced. The engine produces 173 BHP and 127 lb ft of Torque with Dyno sheets to verify"

Plus:

"Close Ratio PTS BE3 with latest 4.8 Tran-X Plated LSD."

Its quick and puts the power down.

Last time out it had a chronic misfire at 6000 rpm (it revs to 7300). Since its last outing it had the water pump changed which ment the cam belt being taken off and refitted, I hit the wall at Silverstone on the side where the coil is fitted. And the petrol changed colour !!

I'd used Total Exellium which was always amber but on this occasion it was colourless. It could be the petrol. I'm draining it down and with Shell 99 in it am going on a rolling road (plus a spare coil) to get it sorted.

One annoying problem is the sump leaks oil (drips a little) apparently its a comon fault with the steel sumps. ??


Steve

do you have an ally tank, if so is it one of those 20 litre jobbies? Back in the day when i had my 205 the tank was a pile of ....... it wasn't welded together properly and leaked in water. i'd have that checked as that might explain the fuel colour change - i.e you mostly have water not petrol. this would have knock on effects i would imagine.

lumenition ecu's are a pita on the 205 as well, i guess you've got vw dizzy, rotor arm and leads. If the spark plug leads stick up a bit then you defo have vw bits on your car. I seem to remember Phil having similar problems back in the day when he was running it.

[SFurness]

It did have an alloy tank but I changed it for a standard tank (50 lites) as I race in Tin Tops CSCC which are 40 mimute races.

Then I discoverd that 205's also have fuel surge problems so it now has a swirl pot and additional pump fitted and could run the tank dry.


The distibutor, leads and coil were all changed recently and were bought from Autoelectrics (Lumenition).

What do you mean by "pita"


Steve

[nyssa7]

Pita = pain in the ar**

[big andy]

i remember this car from the nsscc 2003 phil was a nice kid but the car was so slow my 1380cc mini passed it down the straights .i would be surprised if it had more than 130bhp ish

[SFurness]

I've got the dyno sheets from the previous owner, post Phil. He did a three rebuilds/improvements.

June 2007 146 bhp - 107 at the wheels

October 2007 153 bhp - 107 at the wheels

September 2008 173 bhp - 132 at the wheels. Now with a CR box and 4.8 LSD.

Test carried out by Motorscope of Northalerton.

It will be on a rolling road on March 20th to sort out a misfire.

Steve

[big andy]

well if its got 173bhp its got 173bhp but i know my mini had 88bhp @ wheels 118bhp @flywheel and it went past that 205 easy

and i wouldnt use motorscope because he dosnt no his arse from is elbow

just ask them our they set the load on the rollers!!!!

[Tim Wilkinson]

Check the dates! '03 vs '08?

[SFurness]

Andy,

Your "experience" is 4 years earlier than when Mike started modifying the engine and box.


Steve

[big andy]

ok its not the same engine that make sense the car its self was really nice and one of the better prepared cars

[Thefiesta99]

I use to race with Phil in a nearly stock XR2 in the NSSCC. Though he did sell it so not sure what the new owner did to it