Helmets, Hans, FIA 8860-2004, Snell SA2000

[hotgemini]

So, as happens to us all from time to time I am in the market for a new helmet. I want to keep my options open with regards to the possible later purchase of a HANS device and this had to be kept in mind while purchasing.

So I went to my local motorsport supplier and inquired about helmets, I informed them of my needs and when I mentioned HANS devices the helpful sales assistant informed me that only three of the helmets they carried were 'hans approved'... up until that point everything I read suggested any snell SA2000 helmet could be fitted with a hans....

I tried searching the web but drew a blank

So I emailed my FIA ASN about hans approved helmets and waited... and waited... and waited...

So I searched again and found the list somewhere I'd already looked... The link is here but then I stumbled across the footnote about the FIA 8860-2004 advanced helmet test specification... Now I hadn't heard of this specification so I had a read and for those that don't know its basically a more stringent version of the SA2000 specification, mostly just using the same tests with higher values, with the exception of the impact test which is a single rather than a double impact as discussed here.

Can anyone point to any particular motivation for the FIA introducing its own standard? It seems a little odd, they clearly weren't trying to burn bridges with the SNELL foundation as they clearly made their standard compatible and supplementary to the SA2000 standard. Has there been accidents where questions have arisen as to the ability of SA2000 helmets to adequately protect the wearer?

Should we expect FIA 8860-2004 helmets to become the new standard or is it likely that only the upper helmets in a manufacturers range will be certified to this level?

Another little question, my work as a driving instructor means that I need a terraphone compatible intercom, just reading the FIA regulations, speakers contained within the helmet are specifically prohibited (although earpiece items are allowed) does anyone know why, or is anyone able to suggest someone I could contact to find out why?

Looks like I might have to investigate getting a custom made setup to avoid the hassle of removing and refitting a helmet mounted set-up (helmet mounted microphones don't rate a mention).

[1200Datto27]

Good luck in getting CAMS to respond, I had a state manager there give me a blank look, and had to have the devices explained to him, when I questioned him on whether there was any local person who can fit the restrain posts to an existing helmet. The response that I received to that question was "why do you want to waste your money on one of those things?"

IIRC, the guys in the V8SCS had to send their helmets over to Europe for the fitting, except for one OBE, who flew someone out to do his helmet.

[hotgemini]

I'm thinking I might try contacting snell for guidance, I'm really quite intrigued now. My understanding was that the shell strength requirements of the SNELL SA2000 standard meant that ANY helmet which met the standard would have a suitably strong shell for fitment of a HANS device. Obviously someone got spooked about a potential liability issue.

[Dr Helmet]

We at Phillips Helmets have developed a helmet that is over 50% safer than the best selling Arai helmet in rotational acceleration injuries. As you well know rotational acceleration is the most damaging to the brain stem causing fatalities.

The Phillips helmet has been tested and approved by the British Transport Research Laboratories (TRL). We are in the process of getting the helmet mass produced and onto the market, and we are continuously exposing our helmet to all markets including FIM, the U.S Army, Riddel sports of America The British Police (riot police and army) and many other associations.

we looking at getting snell rated and in the future also hans compatible.

Please contact me if you require further information. ( TRL report business plan )

[Arai GP5]

Most of the V8 guys had their HANS mounting points fitted at the Aust GP when there was a guy out here that could do it (I've heard he worked most of the weekend!!).

But I've also heard that Motorsport Innovations are qualified to fit the fixing points - not sure of this, but im pretty sure there is someone in Oz that can, because plenty of guys in FFord, GTP/NC, Carrera, have them - mostly on Arai GP5s. If your after a Bell, I'm yet to see one that has been fitted with the points in Oz - but I haven't looked very hard. Schuberth do it best, as their helmets come with the points pre-fitted, and in Ferrari's case, the straps as well. But you will have to buy a Schuberth over the net from OS.

Dont worry about the new FIA 8860 standard. Its not compulsory until 2005 for F1, and the only two guys in the world at the moment with complying helmets are Trulli and Button - and their Bell examples are apparently worth $10000 each. Arai and Schuberth haven't even released their examples, and all three wont be on sale for at least 12 months IMHO.

That standard shouldn't filter down to any Australian motorsport for a fairly long time - at least 4 years I'd say. The costs of producing the FIA standard helmets are huge, due to the carbon fibre curing/baking procedures, and what not. And it would be tough to tell an FVee driver that he needs a $10000 helmet to race, when that figure would buy his car 5 times over.

The FIA brought their own standard in as part of Prof Sid Watkins' measures to make F1 safer. I think FIA were keen to bring helmet standards in house, and I also think that the new FIA standard will have maximum weights, which Im not sure that Snell currently has...

[ActiveMS]

Stand 21 in the UK and France are the people to talk to.
The official FIA list of approved helmets is quite limiting. One of my helmets is approved, but I had the posts fitted to both helmets anyway. The guy that fitted the posts works for Stand21 but also does the F1 & F3000 circuit. Very nice chap. Roughly 80 odd quid plus the vat for the posts.

Stand21 have now got a new version of the HANS made in europe (and cheaper) as the US versions were 'supposed'to be low quality carbon fibre. Havent seen them yet to comment.

Take a look at www.stand21.co.uk

Ps. Nope, I dont work for them.

[johnw]

Dr Helmet
Your homepage link has a typo in it.
Interesting concept. Do you have any helmets for sale yet?
John

[Dr Helmet]

sorry it should pk@bpdc.co.uk and the temporary website is www.phillipshelmets.co.uk.

Hopefully we will be producing it in the new year.

[Dr Helmet]

as it is a temporary site it can be unstable but it is www.phillipshelmets.co.uk.

[darcym]

there is nothing on the website other than blueyonder advertisments.

[Dr Helmet]

i know i have just checked it, i will need to seee what is going on. Please bear with me.

[Dr Helmet]

try the link now its http://www.phillipshelmets.co.uk

[hotgemini]

yep, works now.

[Dr Helmet]

basic info only but if you want more i can e mail directly to you.