Chevron B48

[mr.scruffy]

Getting a bit further with this car.

It was bought from Andreason from an ad in autosport. i have copies of the import papers, it was imported to Australia in August 1983 as a roller.

Gary has a letter from Andreason confirming the car but temporarily mislaid, and due to pressing health issues will have to wait.

Documents do not state chassis no. but I dont think there can be any doubt, after all who knew Rahal then?

[driftwood]

Rahal had been around in EEc since 1975 racing then went to usa in 80-81 to do indycar
i can ask him about his old f2 car but i doubt he would recall the chassis numbers of the 2 cars he drove better chris T lists the races any accidents to suggest if a tub swap took place

the fact the car came from andreason may shed light on where the car came from but does not mean it is a true pukka car-it could be the original tub ( plate now fitted to ar eplacement chassis that raced) assembled around a bunch of spare parts

[Chris Townsend]

A little correction of Drifty on Bobby Rahal's racing career [before Bobby does it for him!] He comes from suburb of Chicago, started racing sports cars in SCCA in 1973 then got an Atlantic late 74. Ran North American pro series Atlantic 75-77 with well funded set-ups; ran Euro F3 with Walter Wolf in 1978 then works Chevron drive in 1979 [and drove a Wolf at Canadian GP], before going into CART.

Chevron B48 chassis numbers in 1979 are not, largely, matters of speculation.
Chassis 1: Noted on Rahal's car by Adam Ferrington at Thruxon, April [I have copy of his notes]; also given by Autosport at same meeting; noted on Rahal's car at Donington later in season by both Adam F and Dan Rear. chassis no given in Chevron ad that also describes car as 'ex Rahal' A/S 15.11.79 p. 59.
Chassis 2 went to Japan, we have photo of plate on car in Japan on this thread
Chassis 3 Docking for Huub Rothengatter, noted by Adam F and Dan R at Donington. If necessary I could ask Matt Spitzley to pull out the Docking-Spitzley paperwork
Chassis 4 Observed by Adam F on Siegfried Stohr's car at Donington
Chassis 5 observed on Rahal's spare car at both Silverstone and Thruxton by Adam F, and by Dan R at Donington on Gaillard's car
Chassis 6 F1R gives this for Jochen Dauer's KWS car in 1980, as does Autosprint, so we have every reason to believe it was his in 1979
Chassis 7 Observed by Adam F on Rothengatter's spare at Donington
Chassis 8 Observed by Adam F and Dan R on Devaney's works car at Donington and known therefore to have been the rebuilt prototype car
chassis 9 doesn't appear...
Chassis 10 is known to have gone to Bernard de Dryver

So the possibilities for Rahal are
1; 5 and 9 which never seems to make a race.
We know 5 went to Roy Baker in 1980 because he races it in Rahal's colours early season and A/S notes the chassis number.
We know 1 went to Warren Booth in 1980 because A/S notes the chassis number. We know this car stayed in England to at least 1983 because Jeremy Jackson noted the number on Paul Rhodes' car, and recorded it as ex Booth.
The confusion starts after this because by the late 80s Steve Jewell is said to have both Rahal cars and also chassis 3 which he sells to Alain de Wagter [sp?] in 2004.
I wonder? Does Jewell really have three B48s at some point?

The Baker car is unknown after early 81 until it is said to be in Jewell's hands.
So, we need to clear up Jewell's cars properly. When he got them, what he did with them and where they both are now.
The other possibility is chassis 9. That this never appears means one of two things to me
Either it was a Chevron development car, which Rahal would have driven. Bennett regularly did this with earlier F2/FAtlantics, keeping one car for test work and selling it late season. Against this is that we know 8 was the original development car and there is no sign of another B48 showing up late in 1979.
What Chevron also did was allocate numbers in the build series to replacement tubs for wrecked cars. [Chevron chassis numbers are the same as the original tub number] However, in the case of European series cars, for customs purposes, the wrecked car would keep its original plate. Now, I have always maintained that 9 was a replacement tub for Stohr after he wrecked 04 early in the season [and that rebuilt car appears before de Dryver's 10 so it makes sense]

However, I also note that chassis 8 appears with Gaillard at Pau in early June, which is a bit early for Chevron to give up on their development car.
The fact that Andreasson still has a B48 tub with his Chevron bits in 1983 argues in favour of 9 being a mid season development car rather than a rebuilt wreck; Stohr's original tub was probably scrapped; I don't see Rahal having any tub wrecking shunts in 1979.

So, if your car is ex Rahal [and without a plate it's easy for Andreasson to say ex Rahal at the time] then it is either one of the cars we thought went through Jewell - and there are people better qualified than me to comment on his cars - or it's a development car that never raced. I don't think it's a rebuilt wreck.

Chris

[driftwood]

I don't see Rahal having any tub wrecking shunts in 1979what i wanted to hear! )
Does Jewell really have three B48s at some point?As far as i am aware he had 2 cars for many years retains the blue car and sold 1 circa 03/ 4 to de wagter who also bought the black ex Rahal car that Mr Hadfield rebuilt run with 1600 bda then sold to Worrard 02? then to de wagter 03?
[Chevron chassis numbers are the same as the original tub number] OK If chassis 4 is original tub it should say B4879094 on front bulkhead? if it was retubbed to the later chassis 9 should say 9?- i will look tomorrow
without a plate it's easy for Andreasson to say ex Rahal at the time] If he told me it was raining outside i would go check my self!

next step is to determine where the 9 cars where in 81/2/3/4

[mr.scruffy]

As I said Garys car has build plate #5 on it. So have I got it right there should be a stamping on the front bulkhead as well?

the import papers do not specify which chassis.

there is correspondance between Andreason and the guy who imported it, Murray Wilson, of Melbourne, August 1983, as well as the actual shipping and customs documents. This is the guy Gary bought the car from.

[Steve Wilkinson]

I will try to get in touch with Steve and ask the relevant questions about the B48s he owned.

I know he had the ex-Rothengatter car (Chassis 3) because I provided several photos of the car I had taken at Thruxton in April 1979. I understood that he never raced this car but did race the "ex-Rahal car".

[driftwood]

ive only ever seen the blue livery b48 raced by steve

[Chris Townsend]

Originally Posted by driftwood

As far as i am aware he had 2 cars for many years retains the blue car and sold 1 circa 03/ 4 to de wagter who also bought the black ex Rahal car that Mr Hadfield rebuilt run with 1600 bda then sold to Worrard 02? then to de wagter 03

Presumably Simon could help us with the identity of the car he rebuilt since he is pretty sharp on these matters.
Are you saying that de Wagter has two B48s right now?

As for where the cars were in 81-83

1: Booth to Paul Rhodes
2: In Japan?
3: Bob Fearnley in 1980 then unknown until Jewell
4: In Italy, you tell me you sold it! [You have sold it haven't you?]
5: Baker early 81 then missing and either to Australia or to Jewell
6: Unknown after KWS
7: Elwyn Bickley by 1983
8: Brian Robinson
9: Unknown
10: Norrie Galbraith 1981 then sold by Howlings in 82 and unknown

Chris

[mr.scruffy]

Tried to post this morning but doesnt seem to have happened. apologies if I am repeating.

I have looked at the paperwork a bit closer on Gary's car. there are 2 copies of adverts. The first is Autosport may 81 for a B48 F2 rolling chassis from Amco Racing.

The second is an advert in Autosport, undated, for a ' B48 F2/Atlantic rolling chassis with FG400' from Andreason. This is the car that Wilson bought. there are notes on the ad; Tim Colman and his no. (export manager on other paperwork), 'inboard front suspension', and 'Bobby Rahal'

The deal with Andreason was done in August 83 and the car airfreighted to Melbourne with a set of spare wheels and 14 spare gear ratios Oct 83.

[Dan Rear]

When did Andreason takeover the Chevron name and bits etc from Robin Smith. IIRC Robin still had the stuff in early 83, did Roger A acquire it from him later that year?

If not and it was later, ie 1984 or so, then why was he (Roger A) advertising a B48? Just supposition, but wasn't he based in Hants/Dorset, like Roy Baker. If so, this would point to the car imported into Oz, being the Baker car, -05. Merely supposition of course!

[driftwood]

Chris
1 not had time to ask simon re the b48 car yet
2 not looked at car 4 here yet either still for sale
3 de wagter does have 2 cars
4 car 10 is suspicious if it was with Bob howlings ( amco racing for our ozzie friend! )

Dan
Andreason Racing was in Winchester Hants
Mr Scruffy
car had FG400 when new and in advert but now has FT200 fitted
so what happened?

I need to talk to 2 other folk 1 steve J of course and another useful source of info for this era of sprint hillclimb cars

[mr.scruffy]

DG400 obviously taken out, might have been put in a sports sedan. I'll clear it up better when Gary is a bit better, but as far as i know the car was being prepared for a series here but never finished. It has some local bodywork.

Tony C you may very well know?

[Steve Wilkinson]

This from Steve Jewell just in:

My 2 cars were both bought (1980s) from Eric and Paul Rhodes of Pontefract Yorkshire (painting contractors) via Ray Rowan.

They were chassis numbers 1 and 3

No1 I believe is Rahal which I still own.

No3 I believe is Huub Rothengatter (spelling?). This I sold to Steve Warrad (I think he traded as Maverick Motorsport) who did a wonderful complete rebuild and was raced by his customer in Europe for 2 seasons and last I saw was up for sale maybe 2 years ago. He was based at Edgehill.


So Steve Jewell owned just two B48 chassis. He raced Chassis 1 whilst Chassis 3 was set-up and used as a static display.

[Chris Townsend]

Originally Posted by Steve Wilkinson

This from Steve Jewell just in:

My 2 cars were both bought (1980s) from Eric and Paul Rhodes of Pontefract Yorkshire (painting contractors) via Ray Rowan.

They were chassis numbers 1 and 3

No1 I believe is Rahal which I still own.

No3 I believe is Huub Rothengatter (spelling?). This I sold to Steve Warrad (I think he traded as Maverick Motorsport) who did a wonderful complete rebuild and was raced by his customer in Europe for 2 seasons and last I saw was up for sale maybe 2 years ago. He was based at Edgehill.


So Steve Jewell owned just two B48 chassis. He raced Chassis 1 whilst Chassis 3 was set-up and used as a static display.

Good work Steve
So, we were under a misapprehension about Jewell's cars, and it looks as though there is a strong case for the Australian discovery as the real thing. I don't know if Rahal actually raced chassis 5, for that we'd need a detailed scrutiny of race reports, but certainly there's a strong case for putting the car back to original condition

Chris

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Chris Townsend

Good work Steve
So, we were under a misapprehension about Jewell's cars, and it looks as though there is a strong case for the Australian discovery as the real thing. I don't know if Rahal actually raced chassis 5, for that we'd need a detailed scrutiny of race reports, but certainly there's a strong case for putting the car back to original condition

Chris

Thanks Chris. As for "putting the car back to original condition" I would always favour that route unless of course it has been so badly hacked about by an earlier owner.

[driftwood]

i had just spoken to ray about the cars and had no time to post the info cos some of us have a living to make and other things to do
from the discussion i had with Ray
1 he owned car 10 before NorrieG he bought it from project 4 ( don rennis) and car was 1 year old and he took it with the P4 team 783 march with ft200 fitted ( we think became 1 of the 2 litre BDG hillclimb sprint cars now anomoly here is RR said he sold it to brian Fraser in scotland but long time back he said bill /willy woods leeds area?) B48 car was ex Harksound livery Docoking team car that Creighton seemd to buy for some person or reason and then never used

2 Paul Rhodes was matey with Brian robinson/similar area and i think he bought the robinson B48 Esprit GT car perhaps why he eneded up with 2 B48 cars
RR also said the Robinson Grange sports car ( thundersports) was B48 based he cannot recall if a B48 was sacrificed but he is sure the car is stillsitting on its wheels in a shed SO does that mean another B48 is lurking?

[driftwood]

I have now climbed past the Lola T290 around the spice C1 squeezed past the DFV on display and pulled the nose & cockpit off the B48 and i cannot find a stamped number on front of the tub
where would it be stamped?

update on above Grange its a B42 car
Robinson had 4 cars believe 1 was cut down middle and widened to be the thundersports car
i thought this went to Jim McGaughy Jim stevenson to be there FES bmw powered Thundersports car

[Dan Rear]

Originally Posted by driftwood

i had just spoken to ray about the cars and had no time to post the info cos some of us have a living to make and other things to do
from the discussion i had with Ray
1 he owned car 10 before NorrieG he bought it from project 4 ( don rennis) and car was 1 year old and he took it with the P4 team 783 march with ft200 fitted ( we think became 1 of the 2 litre BDG hillclimb sprint cars now anomoly here is RR said he sold it to brian Fraser in scotland but long time back he said bill /willy woods leeds area?) B48 car was ex Harksound livery Docoking team car that Creighton seemd to buy for some person or reason and then never used

2 Paul Rhodes was matey with Brian robinson/similar area and i think he bought the robinson B48 Esprit GT car perhaps why he eneded up with 2 B48 cars
RR also said the Robinson Grange sports car ( thundersports) was B48 based he cannot recall if a B48 was sacrificed but he is sure the car is stillsitting on its wheels in a shed SO does that mean another B48 is lurking?

So, it looks like -10 was the Harksound/de Dryver/Luyendijk car run on a couple of occasions in '79 by RAM in F2. The to Project 4, though heaven knows why (?), then onto Ray Rowan and to Norrie. Wasn't Harksound owned by G Garon, and backed BdD in Aurora '79?

[Tony C]

So the latest info would suggest the following applies: (copied most from earlier in the thread)



01 [Hart 420R] Works car for Rahal 1979, then to Warren Booth, by 1983 with Paul Rhodes and 1988 with Steve Jewell

02 [BMW M12] Patrese at JAF GP Nov 78, then to Nikko Racing for Fujita. Disappears after 1979

03: [Hart 420R] Docking Spitzley for Rothengatter 1979, then to Bob Fearnley, by 1983 to Steve Jewell, sold to de Wagter about 2004

04: [BMW M12] Trivatello for Stohr 1979, then Tesini in 1980. Bodoni at some point, now for sale in UK [or sold?] THIS IS NOT THE B42 THAT GETS PLATE 48.79.04 [FISHER/ROWAN/RIDGE] IN ABOUT 1981, LET'S NOT START THAT DEBATE AGAIN

05: [Hart 420R] Works Rahal, spare car, also run for Gaillard at Donington, to Roy Baker 1980, probably sold mid 81 when Baker gets a March 802, to Australia 1983, with current owner since 1990

06: [Hart 420R] KWS for Jochen Dauer, retained 1980 then disappears

07: [Hart 420R] Docking Spitzley spare, taken to Macau for Rothengatter then to NZ series early 1980. Wrecked. Sold to Miedecke, then by 1983 with Elwyn Bickley, now with Simon Langman

08: Development car without plate raced at Macau by Patrese [and allegedly raced in Japan in March 1979 by Rosberg...probably 02] Rebuilt as F2 with chassis plate 48-79-08 and driven mid season by Gaillard and Devaney. BDA put back in for Jordan at Phoenix Park. To Brian Robinson 1980. 1984 Bob Nelson, 1985 Paul Rhodes, by 1987 Nigel Sillence and 1989 David Kerr with Rover V8 in it!

09: Probably a new tub for 04 after Stohr did it no end of good. However, given habits in F2 circus and at Chevron the entry is probably blank and the new tub got the plate from 04 to keep the carnets simple.

10: BMW M12 Salisbury: Arie Luyendijk/Bernard de Dryver; 1980 Creighton Brown to Ray Rowan; 1981 Norrie Galbraith, f.s AMCO Racing A/S 14.1.82 p. 61 'ex Galbraith', disappears

[driftwood]

I think that about sums it up however Paul rhodes also had car 3 after Fearnley with car 1 and sold to steve J
later he has car 8 which to us poms is now a donington GT lotus esprit race car from robinson to nelson & rhodes then its back to B48 f2 car for the other 2 owners

[phdm]

While researching the history of Brabham BT36-1, I was in contact with Frenchman Regis Jumez who told me he bought in 1982 a B48 with chassis #2 from Bob Howlings. The car was later crashed and probably destroyed.

phdm

[driftwood]

who said probably destroyed?
is this yr assumption or did regis actually tell you car was so badly damaged he threw it away?

[phdm]

he did but the remains were sold to someone in grenoble
what happened next I don't know and I don't assume anything

[Dan Rear]

phdm, it couldn't have been -03 in Belgium could it rather than -02. If we assume -02 was in Japan in 1979 how/why would Bob H have brought it bak here in the early 80s? Seems more likely he sold the ex-Docking car, -03, which we're fairly sure Fearnley used/owned in 1980 in England.

[phdm]

Dan,
Regis Jumez (from France, not Belgium) was speaking from memory but affirmatively said 02.