307 WRC confirmed

SJ Spode · 10 Oct 2002, 08:56 (Ref:400006)

Corrado Provera has conceded at last that a 307 World Rally Car is under active consideration for the 2004 season. The 206 will definitely remain for 2003.

429CJ · 10 Oct 2002, 18:22 (Ref:400550)

Damn, I was expecting a 406 WRC!!

mac · 10 Oct 2002, 22:07 (Ref:400715)

I don't understand that. Are they getting bored at the front?

Speeddemon555 · 11 Oct 2002, 01:07 (Ref:400779)

Nahh, looks like 206 model has been running for a few years and that the 307 is a newer model from Peugeot.

SJ Spode · 11 Oct 2002, 08:25 (Ref:400961)

Apparently the engine used in the 206 is out of production, so they can only do minor tweaks under the homologation regs.

Guisbro Rod H · 5 Nov 2002, 20:58 (Ref:422478)

If I recall correctly the 206 was only permitted after special dispensation because it was below the minimum length required for a WRC car. This was met by artificially extending the bumpers. Permitted because the 307 was then not in production

The 206 suffers, like many modern small cars, from being too small inside. Poor Gronholm and Burns struggled to fit inside it. Hopefully, the 307 would provide more suitable accomodation and meet the spirit of the regulations; and the 307 needs a marketing boost.

If the 206 engine is old and out of production, then what are the other manufacturers playing at? That engine produces more power than its competitors; I wonder what the 307 engine will produce?

alfasud · 6 Nov 2002, 11:58 (Ref:422888)

My understanding is that they built the required number of cars with the longer bumpers, so I'm not sure how much of special dispensation it was. I'm not sure what is an "artificially" long bumper is? ...compared to one that occurs that long in nature perhaps?

There really isn't much advantage in newer production engine designs. Often they are more compact and lighter, but they are also designed for fuel economy, low emisions and low cost to manufacture, rather than performance potential. Then you end up with all sorts of problems like Ford did with their water pump on the Focus.

Does anyone know what happened about that in the end (Monte 1999)? Were they allowed to keep their non production water pump they ran in the Monte, or did they have to revert to the standard water pump for future rallies?

Guisbro Rod H · 6 Nov 2002, 22:31 (Ref:423343)

Quote:

Originally posted by alfasud
My understanding is that they built the required number of cars with the longer bumpers, so I'm not sure how much of special dispensation it was. I'm not sure what is an "artificially" long bumper is? ...compared to one that occurs that long in nature perhaps?

The 206 was too short to meet the WRC regulations. The bumper shape (front and rear) was modified to increase the length of the 206 to meet the regulations. That might help the front aerodynamics and downforce. I was unaware that they had produced the required number of cars or bumpers(like Alfa did). I read that the FIA had provided a dispensation - but who believes the press?

Guisbro Rod H · 6 Nov 2002, 22:32 (Ref:423346)

Sorry, finger trouble!

imull · 9 Nov 2002, 13:21 (Ref:425107)

I am pretty sure that they prodused the longer bumpers but cant be sure.

Doesnt make much differance to the rally cars as they are made from Carbon Fibre which must be a huge disadvantage over the steel boots on other cars...

Most the peugot advantaage comes from habing a really good chassis to start with, really stiff and quite well balanced too.

While ford were trying to lighten and strengthen the Focus, Pug were making theirs even lighter and stronger again...

Its still ugly though and will be followed by a suitably ugly car.

mac · 10 Nov 2002, 00:16 (Ref:425370)

I reckon the 206 looks great.

alfasud · 11 Nov 2002, 04:23 (Ref:426134)

It was in a Cars and Car Coversions magazine (I can find the issue at home if anyone is interested) where it said they produced 4000 Peugeot 206 GT's, with the longer bumpers (mostly left hand drive), to gain FIA approval of the 206 WRC.

Christopher · 11 Nov 2002, 04:24 (Ref:426135)

The Pug's the best looking car in the WRC. I thought the 206 would be raced until the 207 comes out. Might give the other teams a better chance with Peugeot racing the bigger and heavier 307 in the future. By the way I've seen pictures of a rally Ford Fiesta. Is this a F2 car(is it still called Formula 2?) or Ford's new WRC?
What other makes could enter the WRC in the future? I have heard something about the new Mini. I'd also like to see others join. Opel's Corsa, Alfa's 147, Audi and Toyota.
Personally I can't wait to see if Mitsubishi use the next Mirage (Colt)in the WRC.

alfasud · 11 Nov 2002, 05:11 (Ref:426141)

Some more data....

From Peugeot Sport web site, the dimensions of the Peugeot 206 WRC (Tarmac Spec):

Wheelbase : 2.468 m.
Length : 4.005 m.
Width : 1.770 m.
Weight : 1230 kg.

Data for the Peugeot 206 GTi and 307 road cars from:
http://autozine.kyul.net/html/Peugeot1.htm

206 GTi dimensions.
L / W / H / WB : 3825 / 1650 / 1432 / 2442 mm.

So the length has been increased by 80mm for the WRC car. The width has been increased by 120mm to reach WRC maximum. For some reason, the wheelbase does not exactly match either - 2442mm (GTi) vs 2468 (WRC). Possibly this 24mm difference is within allowed tolerance?

307 dimensions.
L / W / H / WB: 4202 / 1730 / 1510 / 2608 mm.

Does anyone know how this compares with Ford Focus, Subaru and other WRC cars?

If you read the text of the article, the 307 is also very tall (80mm taller than a Focus). Surely this is not a good thing? Of course you can lower the car, but only so much before you are dragging things on the ground in the rougher gravel stages.... or corner cutting on tarmac stages.

Don't think total weight is a huge problem, as WRC has minimum weight limit of 1230kg.

Here are the figures for the Xsara:
http://www.citroen.com/site/htm/en/s...onship/wrc_car

Length: 4167 mm
Width: 1770 mm
Wheelbase: 2555 mm

So if you compare the Xsara, it sits midway between the 206 and 307 for length/wb, in fact if anything, a little closer to the 307. On the other hand, you can bet the Xsara is a lot lower than the 307 (lower c of g). Not sure how much this will matter in practice?

alfasud · 11 Nov 2002, 05:18 (Ref:426142)

Quote:

Originally posted by Christopher
By the way I've seen pictures of a rally Ford Fiesta. Is this a F2 car(is it still called Formula 2?) or Ford's new WRC?

Picture of Fiesta seems to be either;
a) new Super1600 car (don't think they call them F2 anymore),
b) new concept for future WRC car,
c) Something for public to look at instead of photos of the Focus that is normally seen crashed or on fire

SJ Spode · 11 Nov 2002, 09:00 (Ref:426220)

Quote:

Originally posted by Christopher
By the way I've seen pictures of a rally Ford Fiesta. Is this a F2 car(is it still called Formula 2?) or Ford's new WRC?

That's the new S1600 Fiesta unveiled at the recent UK Motorshow

SJ Spode · 12 Feb 2003, 09:15 (Ref:504139)

It's been reported that new bodyshell rules for World Rally Cars in 2004 will make it more likely we'll see a 307 WRC next year.

WRC bodyshells must weigh a minimum of 320 kg in 2004, so the 206 will have to run with a weight penalty.

(It'll be interesting how the new Fabia WRC bodyshell matches up to this also)

Chris Stockdale · 12 Feb 2003, 11:38 (Ref:504280)

I dont like the shape of the 307 and dont think it will as successful but just watch Peugoet will call me a liar

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